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Barrett S

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Reply with quote  #1 
I kind of like the show in the subject.  

I believe it's bringing magic "back" into the realm of entertainment that many who never gave it a thought will enjoy.  I like cards... so when they have a card person doing "close up," that gives cards some additional exposure other than "pick a card."  

And there is the publicity aspect for aspiring magi.

I think Ms Hannigan is doing a great job as actor/host!

I like when Penn speaks "in code."  But sometimes he does not.  Absolutely did not when Shawn Farquhar was on the show the first time - surprising.  Glad he won!

So just curious... anyone else like the show?

Thanks!



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Mike Powers

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Reply with quote  #2 
I do love the show! It definitely has promoted magic and allowed the contestants to beef up their credentials.

There's an unfortunate side effect, though. The side effect is that it encourages the view that magic is to be figured out. Don't viewers pit themselves against the magician too and, as Penn and Teller are doing, try to figure out how it's done? I think they do - at least a certain portion of them. That's the premise of the show - try to fool us and we'll try not to be fooled. It's all about fooling them and, unfortunately, this premise IMO is encouraging a mentality that I fight to discourage viz. the point is to figure out how it's done.

Also, as tmfbls pointed out, their code sometimes falls by the wayside and their thoughts become more transparent to the lay viewers.

Nonetheless I always watch it and enjoy the show.

Mike


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tommyellison

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Reply with quote  #3 
My good friend David Garrard will be on August 31. David is from Louisville KY and grew up with Lance and Mac.

BTW, he has a new book out that is really good.

David is an accomplished stage and close up magician and will be doing a stage illusion for P&T. He has a special ending he incorporated. I doubt if he will fool them but the ending will be a nice surprise for all.

Tommy

P.S. David's Book can be found at: https://davidgarrardmagic.com/davids-book/

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MikeIkirt

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Reply with quote  #4 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tommyellison
My good friend David Garrard will be on August 31. David is from Louisville KY and grew up with Lance and Mac.

BTW, he has a new book out that is really good.

David is an accomplished stage and close up magician and will be doing a stage illusion for P&T. He has a special ending he incorporated. I doubt if he will fool them but the ending will be a nice surprise for all.

Tommy

P.S. David's Book can be found at: https://davidgarrardmagic.com/davids-book/


Ouch! Just went onto the site to check the book out.  My McAfee just went all kinds of red on it.  Wouldn't even let me look at the page!
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Michaelblue

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Reply with quote  #5 
I enjoy the show a lot. I love seeing magicians that, for the most part, only magicians know of, and there they are performing some unique stuff. And the audiences are very enthusiastic.

I think people already have that notion in them, to figure it out. So i don't think that aspect is going to ruin things in the long run.
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tommyellison

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Reply with quote  #6 
Try going to it this way...

https://davidgarrardmagic.com

David says he is sorry this is happening. I am on an a Mac so I cannot replicate

David's email is garrard@bellsouth.net

Tommy

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Barrett S

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Reply with quote  #7 
Hello and thanks for the responses. And the heads up.

So I mentioned our arcane and helpful vernacular or patois.

And as Mike and I noticed sometimes it's there, sometimes not. But the led me to another question... my decoder ring is incomplete... so sometimes (and it can be in other than P&T),
I don't have a real definition, e.g., "getting ahead of the spectators" was one for me. Found that one.

There are encyclopedias of tricks and flourishes. May I ask if anyone knows of a source for magic nomenclature?

Shout out to Mahdi!

Thanks.

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EVILDAN

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Reply with quote  #8 
Penn speaks a language that's pretty new. It seems like he's making it up as he's going along.
I think you just have to be in magic for a while and know the methods to know what he's talking about.
However, it's good to know that a magician doesn't even know what he's talking about on some things.
That means it makes no  or very little sense to the non-magicians.
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Anthony Vinson

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Reply with quote  #9 
I've enjoyed this season's episodes. Alison Hannigan is certainly no Jonathan Ross, but she seems to be enjoying her role as emcee. The featured magician's have been a mixed bag, with mostly strong, entertaining presentations.

The coded references are necessary, but not easy (I would imagine) to come up with on the fly. It seems that we can sometimes see Penn thinking through his response before making it, and sometimes running out of time and communicating more in plain text than code. It could be a good thing if some one watching becomes interested in the craft while Google searching for one of Penn's veiled references. 

I am pleased that they managed to maintain the same format they used in Brittan for the American version. Too often American television requires quick cuts and truncated performances. (For instance, I am unable to enjoy the Masters of Illusion series. Too choppy.)

Has anyone else checked out the YouTube vids the day after the shows air just to read the viewer comments? They're a hoot!    
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Barrett S

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Reply with quote  #10 
Thanks again.

I will check the YouTube videos Anthony Vinson :-)

And I agree EVILDAN, eventually, with time and my pestering people who CAN answer me, I'll get the interesting referernces!

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yourepiphany

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Reply with quote  #11 
Just posted up on the blog about dvd shipping info and Paul Gertner's appearance on Penn & Teller's Fool Us. Paul Gertner graciously gave us permission to share it on the blog post! 

Check it out here:
Paul Gertner and Harry's DVD Lecture Shipping Info
http://www.themagicianslecture.com/blog/the-only-way-out-is-through-and-shipping-info/
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Barrett S

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Reply with quote  #12 
Bringing this one back from the dead.  And believe me, I had to purchase just the correct book that contained just the correct method for necroing a post.

I think above the general consensus is that Penn & Teller Fool Us (PTFU) is liked.  I really like the show.  

Last (PTFU) show (July 20), dude name of Jimmy Ichihana did a very good trick.  It is on YouTube.  Two fun parts resulted:

1. Penn's explanation in code; and
2. General lack of what trick it is and who created it.

1 is evident in the YouTube clip.
2 a very good magic friend and I did some research.  On another forum (where this whole "what is the trick called" started) this trick is called myriad variations of "Call To The Colors."  Just mix up the words, add "March," take out an article, and you'll get most of them.  On the same forum credit is guessed to be (in no order) Guy H, Martin Nash, Hideo Kato, John Scarne, Bill Simon, and then there is an informative post by Paul Chosse (RIP)... Very good conversation and it spanned 14 + years.

Hideo Kato is a respectful and knowledgeable contributor and then goes on to provide what I believe is the true answer.  Hideo Kato has been a valuable source of information and I do like his writing.  

IMHO, Hideo Kato gets it right.  Good for him.  Unless... someone thinks it's wrong.  [confused]  The trick is The trick is Bill Simon's.  It is called "Call To The Colors."  It is based on a Scarne trick.  And it appears in "Effective Card Magic" et al.  And it is based on a John Scarne trick.

If anyone is actually interested in this, you'd have to have seen it, or see it on YouTube.

For a topic of discussion only; no method to be revealed.  Thanks!

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Mike Powers

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Reply with quote  #13 
Thanks for that research Barrett. I had always associated it with Martin Nash. I will definitely pull "Effective Card Magic" and check out Simon's idea. I think Jimmy embellished it a bit too with the suits and then new deck order. I met Jimmy at Dan Block's convention near Buffalo. He's a great guy and he did a superb job on the show. I'm betting that Penn didn't know the name "Call to Colors." I think Mike and Johnny thought that he was close enough when he basically determined that there's an order and some crafty dealing. Too back they used the name, then it's easy to YouTube and find an exposure video. Never say "Invisible Deck" or "Crazy Man's Handcuffs."

Mike


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magicfish

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Reply with quote  #14 
"If anyone is actually interested in this, you'd have to have seen it, or see it on YouTube."
I learned this from Effective Card Magic by Bill Simon many years ago.
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JohnnyNewYork

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Reply with quote  #15 
Hello!  I love that show as well, and I believe P and T promote more interest in magic than detract from it.  The card routine in discussion was awesome (I too thought it was a variation of a Nash routine 'Colors on the March", but I'm not surprised to hear it was originally a Simon routine).  I do know that part of Jimmy's performance made use of a Woody Aragon idea (in "A Book In English").  What a great routine and performance this was, especially while performed under so much pressure!  I believe I heard from a Joshua Jay lecture that P and T actually take about 20 minutes discussing each routine (even though it is reduced in the TV show to about a minute or so).    Personally, I like the approach of Steven Youell regarding all of this -- I try to focus on the performance rather than getting too caught up in figuring out the puzzle.  While some lay people may immediately start to reverse-engineer things, I'd like to believe that most people simply enjoy the entertainment, the mystery, and the skill of the performer.  Thanks Barrett for the info and the post!  johnny  
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Barrett S

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Reply with quote  #16 
Hey there Magicfish.  I am super-happy you know the trick.  Very happy.

And I always like to be quoted. 

Just to ensure I was and am clear, I was always referring to those that had either seen PTFU or if not, the show was on YouTube.   It's hard to be understood sometimes on a forum.  Even this post which has Penn & Teller in the subject.

However... I do not advocate in any way magicians not getting paid for their work.  Seems you might have thought that.  Maybe not.  Now you know in any case.

I do advocate using YouTube to watch an episode of PTFU if you want to.

Or, don't read this Magicfish, and then you get some time back.

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Barrett S

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Reply with quote  #17 
Mike and JNY,  very interesting and kind of fun to research.  Especially with Penn's long explanation.

I looked very carefully at Bill Simon's "Call To The Colors."  In the writing I infer that he encourages the reader to use his trick and embellish it.  Use it as a framework. 

If i am right, then it made a very nice framework for whoever many others and certainly for the gentleman on PTFU.  He was skilled and entertaining.

I do think PTFU adding to the art.  

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Mike Powers

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Reply with quote  #18 
Although I do love P&T and think the show generally helps magic, I still have reservations. I think the premise of the show inevitably encourages people to do what they're doing viz. figure out the method. You see some great magic and immediately are focused on method. Not only that, but the method is openly discussed, albeit in coded language, by the guys whose job it is to figure out the method.

I just can't shake the feeling that the show is double edged and that one of the edges hurts magic.

Mike
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Anthony Vinson

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Reply with quote  #19 
Just watched Jimmy's performance - Man, that was beautiful! Superb handling under, as Johnny pointed out, extreme pressure. 

Personally I like the show. Where else do we have the opportunity to see so many wonderful magicians? Conventions? Tough to get to and often prohibitively expensive after travel, meals, lodging, money for the dealer's room... It is true that much of Penn's code talk facilitates quick, easy internet searches, but how many people go to the trouble? I suspect not many, and some of those that do may just become interested in taking up magic as a hobby. 

Barrett, interesting verb there; I wasn't familiar with it, and being a wordsmith of sorts, had to look it up. Mind that I wasn't proofing your post, but rather following my own patterns when presented with new words! 
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EVILDAN

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Reply with quote  #20 
In thinking about the double edged sword that Mike Powers mentions.

I haven't had anyone lately actively try to figure out the magic that I'm performing. At least not in front of me. 

In further thinking about what you said, maybe this whole exercise of Penn and Teller trying to figure out the magic is a good thing.

On the one hand you mention that the show "encourages people to do what they're doing viz. figure out the method."

On the other hand, maybe watching the show and seeing that even Penn and Teller can't figure some tricks out helps diffuse the challenge aspect of magic. Surely if two working pros can't figure some magic out how can someone who doesn't even know where magicians go to learn their tricks know how it was done.

Even with the exposure aspect of the show, they always compliment magicians on how well something was done, whether it was a sleight or the entire routine. So maybe that too can shape the minds of our audiences to appreciate the skill that it takes to make magic happen.
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Harry Lorayne

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Reply with quote  #21 
    I used to be able to catch Fool Us on CW56 - a station here in Massachusetts. Haven't been able to find it for some time now. Can someone tell me channel, day, time? HL.
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rready

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Reply with quote  #22 
Harry,

              I get it on CW23, I believe it's also on CW14, at 8:00 pm. Not exactly sure of the day it is usually on. I'll try to find out more. 
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Barrett S

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Reply with quote  #23 
Ya beat me rready.  [smile]

Mr. Lorayne, 

So this may help.  It is on the CW channel as rready indicated.  However, depending on your provider, e.g., Comcast, AT&T, the channel number may be different. In Chicago it is on Thursday nights.  In Springfield, MA for instance, it is on Thursday 8pm to 9pm.  The day/time jibes with Chicago, since you are on EDT.  In that city it is on WWLP, but again, the provider may differ.

If you PM me your provider, I'll get the information.

Thanks!  You should be on it!  

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Barrett S

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Reply with quote  #24 
Hi Anthony Vinson, I am uncertain which verb you refer to.  I always verb-ize nouns; it's in the Chicago Style Book.  Sometimes they stick.

I also make HUGE mistakes and try not to let something go out misppeled.  But it happens.

And if I do err, it's my idiocy.

I also like words.  It's putative that one not get magic gratis if there is an entity entitled to remuneration.  I bet you'd agree on that.  Time for noontime victuals, which I will carefully masticate as it is placed into my alimentary canal.  I hope you enjoy your repast.

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Harry Lorayne

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Reply with quote  #25 
     Thanks Barrett - I'll try it this Thursday.  I honestly don't know my provider - my son set all up for me. I do see SEIKI come on screen whenever I open either of my TV sets.
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Harry Lorayne

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Reply with quote  #26 
       Oh, where I used to see the show at 8PM on CW56 - now it's Family Feud there at  that time every evening.
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Harry Lorayne

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Reply with quote  #27 
    Oh, sorry - I'm confused (nothing new - I usually START confused!).  Actually it's 7/News that has Family Feud on at 8PM every weekday evening. Right next to that station is that CW56 station - and I thi!nk that there's where I'd see Fool Us. Anyway - I'll try that this Thursday. Not really a large problem
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Mike Powers

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Reply with quote  #28 
Barrett - you need to eschew obfuscation, dude.

Mike
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Blathermist

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Reply with quote  #29 
Haven't seen the US version of P&TFU, so haven't seen the performance in question.

Regarding Call To The Colours (sorry Colors) I'm always happy to be pointed towards earlier references to anything, but as far as I'm concerned, the following is correct:

"In the list I posted earlier, I forgot to include Bill Simon’s "Effective Card Magic" and his two booklets, "Controlled Miracles" and "Sleightly Sensational". I don’t have the booklets anymore, but if memory serves, "Controlled Miracles" contains "The Scarne Puzzle," out of which came Simon’s "Call To Colors".

I posted this on the Anneman's Card Magic Thread.
My reference to the "Scarne Puzzle" is correct.
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Stevie Ray Christian

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Reply with quote  #30 

Penn and Teller, through gut-feeling, calculation, daring-do and happy accident, have elevated the art of magic. It could be argued in their 42 years as a performing duo, P&T have modernized, hip-ified, and promoted the art well beyond any previous measure.

 

I watched all available clips of F.U. from the BBC. These seasons are a delight. Penn’s gleeful and erudite evaluations of the performances are priceless. His stage persona—full of bombast and brimstone—is peeled away to reveal a thoughtful and generous man, in love with methods and history and theater. He is, as always, speaking for Teller too.

 

Mike brings a valid concern about challenging the viewer to reduce wonder into logic. Penn and Teller have long played with this conundrum in their act. It’s quite like seeing a brief vignette of a stage play. Two actors performing five minute scene from Taming of The Shrew will entertain but not transport the audience. Despite the costumes, the set, the language and the delivery… the audience will not laugh as hard or fully empathize or understand the relationships. No matter how visual and powerful the opening scene of a play, the audience is not yet ensconced in the fantasy. All facets must combine over time to eventually marinate the audience.

 

With rare exceptions, the performance of magic on television has always been truncated. Five minutes on a talk show is about the limit for magicians. Shakespeare couldn’t have imagined this kind of challenge. Penn and Teller rank high among the few who understand and repeatedly rise to the occasion within the limits of the medium.

 

Their 90-minute stage show is a traditional series of vignettes. The focus is on laughter, shock and awe, teasing and challenging the absurdities of our shared reality. Though they repeatedly fool their spectators, the characters onstage don’t appear to give a damn about the deceptions. This thread not only creates more laughter and irony, it pushes the art form into the realm of great theater… I know Tybalt did not really drive his sword into Mercutio’s solar plexus… but I felt it… I wish it hadn’t happened… and I fret over the repercussions.

 

The premise of Fool Us does increase the vulnerability of the performer stepping out from the wings. He or she is being burned before they hit their mark. Anyone who performs magic publicly, experiences this kind of scrutiny the moment they open. It simply takes time for the audience to surrender their skepticism… and no matter how strong and artful the performance… well, one cannot fool all the people all the time. 

 

While P&T have exacerbated a condition which already exists, they’ve also exploited a triviality that is rife in the brotherhood… magicians focused solely on fooling other magicians. This offshoot is rarely theatrical or transcendent. Most F.U. guests who manage to create engaging entertainment are not bound to win the day. When the rare contestant hits all the notes and leaves Teller’s mouth hanging wide open… it’s certain to be good theater, pure astonishment and proof that, no matter how much expertise one may have gained, real wonder is still possible. It is those moments, for me, that supersede any flaw in the F.U. premise.  

 

Beyond that, this show is not only inspiring enthusiasts from all ranks, it is sending out the call to neophytes and will quite likely foster a new renaissance in magic. The significant and consistent encouragement of females as conjurers has never been more pronounced and will surely impact the art in new and important ways.

 

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Anthony Vinson

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Reply with quote  #31 
Barrett, the verb to which I referred was necroing, a neologism of which I was unaware. That said, your verbosity is exacerbated by your bombast - or vice-versa - but either way, I dig your rap, dude!

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rready

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Reply with quote  #32 
Hello Barrett,

                       I live about 10 miles from Springfield. If your from around there, we've probably crossed paths.
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Barrett S

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Reply with quote  #33 
Wow is this off topic, but kind of fun.

Mike, yes I should.  But I'd rather avoid hidden stuff.  Or maybe I could duck occult stuff.  I'll cogitate which will cause perseveration.  And then I will fall asleep.

Anthony Vinson I had to look up neologism.  Necroing may not be a word yet.  But it might be some day.  As you know English, unlike C++, is a natural language. It might be commuted where an artificial language will generally not be.  It would be funny if someone in Internet-Land decided to make the C++ version of "copy" volatile to eliminate the C++ version of "move."  And not tell anyone.  Really the fact that both of us took the time to look up the words makes us kindred spirits. That is why I like my Kindle.   

Mr Lorayne, it would be on whatever channel is "The CW" or "CW."  It is a network like ABC.  It should be on Thursday at 8pm edt.   But I must also point out that the episodes are almost immediately put on YouTube.  The one that got me talking and other episodes are there.  In fact here is a safe link to the one we are kicking around -->
 ... to get this to play you must copy from http.............all the way to the last capital Y. Paste that in your favorite browser and you'll be able to see this person.  Seriously, if this makes no sense, no worries.  If you wish PM me and we'll figure a way to walk you through it.  I promise you that.  ADDITION:  Look at that it turned into a live link.  It'll play right in the post!

But wait.  I just heard something.  Oh it's Magicfish gonna write another out of context insult.  Incoming...





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Reply with quote  #34 
Previous episodes can be found here:  http://www.cwtv.com/shows/penn-teller-fool-us/

And even the most recent one shows up only 1 or 2 days after it airs.

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Barrett S

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Reply with quote  #35 
Necroing my own post.  Sad.

CONGRATULATIONS to David Parr for fooling Penn & Teller.   Turns out Mr. Parr is from Chicago.  I don't know him.  Maybe he is on the forum.  

His trick was at once fun, entertaining, baffling, and it got Alyson Hannigan involved in a great way.  She is marvelous.

So... maybe Mr. Parr will see this.  Nicely done sir!

Didn't see it?  Want to?  YouTube.  Let me be abundantly clear so as to avoid any incoming.  I am referring to Mr. Parr's performance on the show.  Full stop.

p.s., two weeks from last show, that'd be August 24th, another person from my area will be on the show.  Glenn Morphew!

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Mike Powers

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Reply with quote  #36 
Indeed Kudos to Mr. Parr. Well done. He made a fairly simple two deck matching trick into an entertaining performance piece. I'm surprised P&T were so utterly fooled. I think Penn just said, "We have no idea" and gave him the trophy.

I'll be seeing David next week in Milwaukee. We're both working at a small convention there. He should be basking in the glow of this fine achievement. BTW his book "Brain Food" is very good. I'm not sure if it's still available though?

Mike
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Michaelblue

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Reply with quote  #37 
David Parr held an event at the Greenhouse Theater in which the show was shown on a big screen and a bunch of magicians and other friends attended. It was really fun. 

The con man who went by the name of Aiden Sinclair was full of bs on everything he said, starting with his name, which is really Richard Othier.  He insinuated himself into the magic scene in D.C. when i lived there and i dont believe for a minute that he gone straight.
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Barrett S

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Reply with quote  #38 
Thanks for the info Mike and Michaelblue.  

Mike, Penguin has "Brain Food." Now updated and pdf-ified, it is called "Brain Food: Gourmet Edition."

Penguin can refresh their bits with a new copy, since one is now on my drive headed to the Kindle.

Yeah Michaelblue, I looked at that show.  Looks very cool.  Thanks for the tip.

[smile]


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Anthony Vinson

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Reply with quote  #39 
Dan Sperry's appearance on last night's episode was hilarious. He's really taken that character to new places.



Penn's debriefing was subtle enough that it probably flew over the heads of most.


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EVILDAN

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Reply with quote  #40 

Ahhh. I had haunt actor auditions last night.

Missed Penn & Teller. But I think they do a repeat on the weekend.

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MagicTK

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Reply with quote  #41 

You can usually catch the show the next day online  http://www.cwtv.com/shows/penn-teller-fool-us

 

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Intensely Magic

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Reply with quote  #42 
I'm surprised no one mentioned Penn whizzing all over The Magic Circle - last week I believe. I found it hilarious, personally. I may stand alone in that.

Any thoughts?

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Anthony Vinson

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Reply with quote  #43 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Intensely Magic
I'm surprised no one mentioned Penn whizzing all over The Magic Circle - last week I believe. I found it hilarious, personally. I may stand alone in that.

Any thoughts?


Nah, I thought it was hilarious myself. Frankly I am surprised we don't discuss the show more here on the forum. It's a real boon for magic, especially close-up. They give these acts 8 - 15 minutes to perform - Wow! I've tried to watch a couple of episodes of Masters of Illusions and the cuts are way too fast for this old man. There's lots of diverse talent on Fool Us, and P&T really seem to enjoy themselves. 
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Intensely Magic

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Reply with quote  #44 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony Vinson


.........Frankly I am surprised we don't discuss the show more here on the forum. It's a real boon for magic, especially close-up. They give these acts 8 - 15 minutes to perform - Wow! I've tried to watch a couple of episodes of Masters of Illusions and the cuts are way too fast for this old man. There's lots of diverse talent on Fool Us, and P&T really seem to enjoy themselves. 


I totally agree. I think it is one of the most important things to happen to magic in a very long time. 

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EVILDAN

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Reply with quote  #45 
Masters of Illusions leaves me cold. It's add though the magicians are rushing through the magic and...it's hard to explain, but it feels so empty.
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Michaelblue

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Reply with quote  #46 
I can't recall his name, but i liked the performance of the guy who did the science! trick with the mis made bill and all. 
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Barrett S

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Reply with quote  #47 
Anthony Vinson, I agree with you.  Penn & Teller: Fool Us has gotten much better with charming talent.  But I am biased re talking about it because I am the OP.

Michaelblue the "science guy" is named "Dyno Staats."

And one last reminder that this coming Thursday, August 24, , Chicagoland's Glenn Morphew will be on the show.

It is on the CW and that's anywhere depending on where you are.



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Joey Ace

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Reply with quote  #48 
Kudos to Dan Sperry for that character. Excellent example of making bizarre magic palatable thru the use of comedy.

Alison's reactions and "ad-libs" were so perfect that I suspect they were also scripted.
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Tom G

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Reply with quote  #49 
I'll have to admit I'm not a regular watcher, but I do get surprised by some of the things that do fool them.
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prestigiazione.it

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Reply with quote  #50 
Hello, but what do you think of some of the recent foolers? in my opinion there is something changing in terms of quality...

P&T could be really fooled but one of the most known trick of Tamariz:


or from classics of magic for beginners


even if both done with a lovely presentation?

Also I think Jonathan Ross was better than Alyson Hannigan, more funny, more smart, more entertaining.

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