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Mind Phantom

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I am thinking about doing a booktest using the book called A Course In Miracles. I haven't thought about the method yet, but, I want to talk about "channeling ", and new thought kinda things.

Do you think I am going to far using the book ACIM, do you think it will upset others who believe in such things ? What about the other books like the Bible or the Koran or books like A Conversations With God ?

I don't do effects with my tarot deck as people may get the wrong idea, but, what about a booktest, yes or no.

Best,




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Anthony Vinson

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Reply with quote  #2 
You will offend someone. Can't be helped.

To my way of thinking it's the ideas contained within a book, and not the book itself that matters. I would not be offended regardless of which book you used, so long you were respectful toward those who consider the ideas contained within the book to be sacred. But that's me.

You might consider a more generic book, say a commercial title on the same subject, be it miracles, the nature of reality, or whatever. That would offer you opportunities to mention some of those other books without offense.

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Mind Phantom

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Reply with quote  #3 
That's good advice AV...
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EVILDAN

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Offending the wrong person might get you killed too.
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arthur stead

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I agree.  You’ve got to be so careful these days. 

On a much less drastic note, I’ve always been tempted to buy a copy of “How to Pick Pockets For Fun And Profit”, and read it while traveling on a bus or subway train … just to see what kinds of reactions I get!


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EVILDAN

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Reply with quote  #6 
That would be a great book to read while waiting too see if you'll serve on jury duty.
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Mind Phantom

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Reply with quote  #7 
I did find a book in my book collection that deals with miracles and that book is called Real Magic by Dr. Wayne Dyer, lots of good content in there.

My thinking is that I am going to a lot of online research on " miracles " and see what I can find. Anybody have any suggestions for me ? Any books paperback, of course..would be cool.

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Blathermist

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Reply with quote  #8 
I have never been comfortable with what the farternity calls Gospel Magic and the mere thought of using The Bible or anything resembling a Holy Text for a booktest just makes me Cringe. Definitely a Big No-No.

I have a vague recollection that Paul Daniels used The Bible on TV donkey's years ago, but can't be sure. Memory fades, so please don't take my all-to-often faulty recollections as gospel.
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Paul Hallas

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Reply with quote  #9 
Years back Al Mann marketed a gaffed Bible, The Houdini Bible. Apparently Houdini used something similar when exposing fake mediums. I own one, did consider using it with other 'best selling' books in a test but never got around to it. Probably just as well. I think with the right approach it could be used, but why bother risking offence when so many are easily offended these days.

Al Mann was selling it more as a collectible than as something he expected mentalists to actually use. 

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Medifro

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Reply with quote  #10 
I'm originally from the Middle East and I have lived in Saudi Arabia for quite some time and been involved heavily with the local magician's community in Riyadh, the capital city. We jammed about effects using the Holy Books, such as having someone read the Bible but actually is reciting the Qura'an ( far easier than the other way around, as people memorize the Qura'an and that was a central piece of our daul-reality-based method ). We also thought of having verses as predictions ( so a verse on Wine would be the prediction of a patoe-force of some sort ). I tinkered with Pegasus Page style effect with theological connotations as well. 

The country has grown far more liberal than it used to be, however, these effects admittedly push the envelope. 

I worked on confabulation routine where the presentation is about creating a religion right there on stage, with the prediction being the first page of our own holy book. 


And so on and so on. 


Of note, Riyadh, Saudi's capital city, had been home for Andrew Wimhurst who is one of the best card handlers you'll ever see. There used to be a physician there who was a very close magic friend with Lennart Greene. Doug McKenzie, a phenomenal NYC magician and a David Blaine consultant, grew up there too. Recently, Steven Brundage performed his Rubik cube act there. Interesting factoid: Your rates as a performer go up depending on your social media status. A friend of mine can charge up to a 10,000$ for a 45 minute show, where another can do the same for less than a 1000$. Up to recently the visa process complications allowed local performers to hold rein over growing live entertainment market, unlike Dubai for example where big names like Alain Nu and Marc Paul have performed. 
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Rudy Tinoco

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Reply with quote  #11 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Medifro
I'm originally from the Middle East and I have lived in Saudi Arabia for quite some time and been involved heavily with the local magician's community in Riyadh, the capital city. We jammed about effects using the Holy Books, such as having someone read the Bible but actually is reciting the Qura'an ( far easier than the other way around, as people memorize the Qura'an and that was a central piece of our daul-reality-based method ). We also thought of having verses as predictions ( so a verse on Wine would be the prediction of a patoe-force of some sort ). I tinkered with Pegasus Page style effect with theological connotations as well. 

The country has grown far more liberal than it used to be, however, these effects admittedly push the envelope. 

I worked on confabulation routine where the presentation is about creating a religion right there on stage, with the prediction being the first page of our own holy book. 

 


Sounds like a fascinating session!!

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JustChico

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Reply with quote  #12 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blathermist
I have never been comfortable with what the farternity calls Gospel Magic and the mere thought of using The Bible or anything resembling a Holy Text for a booktest just makes me Cringe. Definitely a Big No-No.


I both agree with Blathermist and disagree at the same time. I think it really depends on your audience. If your intended audience is people who are into "channeling and new thought kinda things" you may be able to get away with it. I guess I'm sort of echoing what Anthony said.

The part where I sort of disagree with Blathermist (and this could very well be more suited to a different thread) is along the same lines. Back when I was a youth minister, I had no problem using magic effects as illustrations. I think it is a really handy tool. However, I don't think I would ever use "Gospel Magic" as the means for what many people would term "proselytizing." I'm not shy about my faith and will openly talk about it with anyone who wants to engage in the conversation. But, the idea of using deception in order to point someone to the Truth makes me, as Blathermist said, cringe. I know, it's a really fine line and some would say it's a "to-MAY-to, to-MAH-to" thing. I'm not really sure that I'm even effectively communicating my idea. But it's not like I would just approach someone and perform a "Gospel Effect" for the sole purpose of outreach. But, if I'm in a situation where someone is interested and we are already engaged in a conversation and the topic comes up, I wouldn't have a problem using an effect as, again, an illustration.

I'm honestly not too crazy about effects that are marketed as "Gospel Illusions." From what I've seen, the canned message in the patter is really weak. But, I suppose that's where we as artists need to make things our own, huh?

I hope that didn't go too far off the rails to be helpful. I guess I would summarize by saying, "Be careful of your audience, like Anthony said."
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Rudy Tinoco

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Reply with quote  #13 
As most of you know, I'm a Christian. With that said, I'm not a fan of Gospel magic in the way that it's usually presented.

Here is how I used magic to help me communicate a message to my church family a few years ago. I started my sermon by sharing about the brokenness of my childhood; my parents divorce, the death of my younger brother (Bobby), etc.

Using Gypsy Balloon, I spoke about the hope that I have in the ultimate restoration of all things.

I'm not sharing this to preach at you guys. I simply want to show that magic can be used to effectively help communicate any message (Christian or otherwise), in a way that is both magical and memorable (hopefully).



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JustChico

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Reply with quote  #14 
Rudy, I'm right there with ya, bro! I just don't have a cool video to illustrate my point [smile]
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Mind Phantom

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Reply with quote  #15 
Ok, this is my outline for the booktest, I don't have the patter & presentation down but, this is the bear basics of what I've got so far;

~ Talk about channeling & altered states of consciousness
~Talk about the most well known text of channeled material, A Course In Miracles


~ Bring out the ACIM and have a participant exam the book
~ Turn my back to the spectator, have them select any page and have them write that down on a pad of 
   paper, also have them select any word on that page and write that down as well ( but the word needs 
   to be not a short 2 or 3 letter word or a really long word, but somewhere in the middle )
~ They write the page number and a middle sized word
~ They are told to hold the pad of paper to there chest, so no one can see it
~ I then write what is I am picking up from the spectator, then I place the marker down on the table
~ They then show the audience what they wrote
~ Then I show what I wrote, and it's a perfect match

As far as the method goes, I am thinking about using a B*** W*****, but that could change the more I mess with it.

And that's it..what do you think ? Lots of work needed here..

Best,

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Paul Hallas

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Reply with quote  #16 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Logan Five
Ok, this is my outline for the booktest, I don't have the patter & presentation down but, this is the bear basics of what I've got so far;

~ Talk about channeling & altered states of consciousness
~Talk about the most well known text of channeled material, A Course In Miracles


~ Bring out the ACIM and have a participant exam the book
~ Turn my back to the spectator, have them select any page and have them write that down on a pad of 
   paper, also have them select any word on that page and write that down as well ( but the word needs 
   to be not a short 2 or 3 letter word or a really long word, but somewhere in the middle )
~ They write the page number and a middle sized word
~ They are told to hold the pad of paper to there chest, so no one can see it
~ I then write what is I am picking up from the spectator, then I place the marker down on the table
~ They then show the audience what they wrote
~ Then I show what I wrote, and it's a perfect match

As far as the method goes, I am thinking about using a B*** W*****, but that could change the more I mess with it.

And that's it..what do you think ? Lots of work needed here..

Best,




I'm getting an impression, an impression you meant to put an N and not a B...
For awhile I was trying to figure out what a Bold Wallet was lol.
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Mind Phantom

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Reply with quote  #17 
HAHA...your right. But it still starts with an B.
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