Sign up Latest Topics Chat
 
 
 


Reply
  Author   Comment  
Robin Dawes

Avatar / Picture

Honored Member
Registered:
Posts: 1,645
Reply with quote  #1 
Here's an interesting article: http://www.skepdic.com/Hyman_cold_reading.htm

Robin
0
Mike Powers

Avatar / Picture

Honored Member
Registered:
Posts: 2,549
Reply with quote  #2 
I was fortunate to meet Ray when I lectured in Oregon a couple of years ago. Very interesting guy indeed. I think he's a founding member of the Skeptic Society.

Mike
0
Claudio

Inner Circle
Registered:
Posts: 275
Reply with quote  #3 
Very interesting article, thanks for sharing, Robin.

Ray Hyman is not the only one to have converted from shut-eye palm reader (or whatever) to psychologist.

Furthermore, psychologists themselves are far from immune to believing in their own fallacies.

Here's another fascinating article about clinical Rorschach experts:

Famous clinical psychologists used the Rorschach Inkblot Test to arrive at incredible insights. But were the astounding performances of these Rorschach Wizards merely a variation on astrology and palm reading?

The Rorschach Inkblot Test, Fortune Tellers, and Cold Reading
0
Robin Dawes

Avatar / Picture

Honored Member
Registered:
Posts: 1,645
Reply with quote  #4 
Thanks for that link, Claudio - it's a fascinating article.

I was amused to see that the first source in the references is a book by "Robyn Dawes" ... I have occasionally been asked if that is me.   The answer is no, he's the famous one. [smile]  What makes it even more confusing for people is that his book is titled "House of Cards" !

All the best

Robin
0
Magic-Aly

Avatar / Picture

Inner Circle
Registered:
Posts: 607
Reply with quote  #5 
The Hyman article provides some fascinating insight into the perception (or lack thereof) of the human brain/psyche and how it processes events and information within various contexts.  

I wonder if anyone has any ideas as to how we can apply the principles discussed in the article to make our magic stronger and/or more entertaining?
0
Robin Dawes

Avatar / Picture

Honored Member
Registered:
Posts: 1,645
Reply with quote  #6 
Many years ago I was performing for a family friend.  One of the effects I did was the old card force that involves covering the deck with a handkerchief and asking the volunteer to cut the deck through the hanky (anyone who doesn't know this force can ask - I'll post it in Sessions).  My presentation was simply "Please cut the deck at the 7 of Diamonds - you got it!  Now cut to the 5 of Hearts - you got it again!  Now cut to the King of Diamonds - excellent"  At this point the volunteer said "Stop, this is freaking me out.  I don't know how I am doing this."

Some people are really willing to believe that they have latent paranormal abilities.  I don't know if I like the idea of reinforcing that, but I know there are lots of people who feel differently.

But a presentation that talks about cold reading could work in the same way that gambling-expose routines do.  Also, Tony Eng used to do a fantastic pseudo-cold-reading routine when he owned Tony's Trick and Joke Shop in Victoria BC.  He would have a volunteer deal a few face up cards from a shuffled deck, and "based on their responses to the dealt cards" he would proceed to tell them how many siblings they had, where they grew up, who their favourite musician was, etc etc.

Robin
0
Mind Phantom

Avatar / Picture

Honored Member
Registered:
Posts: 1,496
Reply with quote  #7 
If the term " cold reading " means reading someone, without knowing anything about them, or having any information about them, except..observing their body language or observing their clothes or jewerly, or just getting intuitive impressions from them, then I am guilty of being a cold reader.

I used to be on a private mentalist forum where most of the poster's would say, " I just follow my oracle, I don't cold read ". What there really saying is they don't use stock lines.

I believe that " stock pharases " are just a legitimate system just like the tarot, or palm reading. Each stock phrase has the power to detonate imagery in the participants mind, just like cards or stones do.

My goal as a tarot reader is to make sure that the sitter is in some way empowered when they leave my table, and to make them feel better about there life.

I didn't read the whole article, but what I did read, I kinda agree with it.

I have more to say on this topic, but, I've had a long day.


__________________
Self Concept Is Destiny...
0
Mind Phantom

Avatar / Picture

Honored Member
Registered:
Posts: 1,496
Reply with quote  #8 
I think that one who is interested in giving readings to the public should read T.A Waters essay's in fortune-telling in his tome Mind, Myth & Magick. I think one has to go at this for the right reasons.

Today my approach to the cards are different. I see the cards as a personal tool for self development, by that I mean, I believe that most of the cards in the Rider Waite Smith deck can point to spiritual and metaphysical lessons or concepts that the sitter can apply to one's life i.e the Law of Attraction, A Course in Miracles or the teachings of the great master's.

So, the goal of my reads is to not try to predict the sitters future, but rather presenting choices or directions to help the seeker go in the path that they want to go in. The seeker creates their own future on the road of they want to go on.

I know I have added things to the traditional meanings of the RWS tarot deck for my own use. But it is something I have done over the course of the years. I feel comfortable which my approach.

You have to be very careful what you say to the sitter, because they will remember what you said for there whole lifetime. 

__________________
Self Concept Is Destiny...
0
Stefan Alexxis

Member
Registered:
Posts: 15
Reply with quote  #9 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Logan Five
I believe that " stock phrases " are just a legitimate system just like the tarot, or palm reading. Each stock phrase has the power to detonate imagery in the participants mind, just like cards or stones do.


I suspect we all use stock phrases. Everybody who has to explain things repeatedly to different customers or clients has them. Doctors, plumbers, salespeople, everyone. But stock phrases have to be distinguished from stock readings. It's one thing to have a standard way of explaining a certain type of fate line on the palm, f'rinstance, and something else again to have two or three different universal stock readings to rotate.

When I say, "I just follow my oracle," I mean I don't use stock readings. I do repeatedly use similar phrases when talking about a number three life path or the motions of a pendulum.

Even so, it's important to use them carefully. While stock lines are indeed as valid as other oracular indicators -- like cards, numbers, or stones -- they can become dangerous when two friends compare their readings and find they were both told the same thing. That will seem reasonable if they note that it was because they have similar lines on their palms or because they both drew the 8 of Wands, but you don't want them to suspect (rightly or wrongly) that you just say the same thing to everybody.
0
Tom G

Honored Member
Registered:
Posts: 1,284
Reply with quote  #10 
This is a true story from years ago.  My dentist at that time was a buddy and after a filling he said he wanted to talk to me in his office.  Couldn't figure that one out......  He tells me a story about a guy he met on an airplane.  The guy told him things about him being in the medical field and some other things and then mentioned that blue was very special to him.  I understood where he was going.  His son's nickname was Blue and he passed due to an overdose.  He told me, "if that guy had told me to jump out of that ******* airplane, I would have."  Then the reader explained how he did it all.  Who was it?  None other than Herb Dewey-King of the Cold Readers. Nothing like being read by the best.
0
Mind Phantom

Avatar / Picture

Honored Member
Registered:
Posts: 1,496
Reply with quote  #11 
Just recently, for about a month now..I have been studying Palmistry and I have done about a dozen readings for people at work and for friends too. And basically I have been giving the these participants the meanings of the lines only, many think I am spot on, with the reads.

No cold reading lines or barnum statements, just the meaning of the lines only. I find that the reading is more of a personal nature rather than the Tarot, but I can see how they could both, tarot and palms can work together. My goal is to do a 10 minute palm reading at the farmers market and do entertainment palm readings at parties from three to five minutes for each participant.

I found another palm reader who is very well known to others here on this forum. He does a ten minute palm reading at psychic fairs along with his tarot readings, he charges $40 for a ten minute palm reading and $80 for the tarot reading lasting ten minutes too. If the sitter wants a tarot reading..he will read the palm for free. I can't charge as much as he does in my local market, but it's a good yardstick to compare with.

Anyways, that's enough of my rant.



 

__________________
Self Concept Is Destiny...
0
Previous Topic | Next Topic
Print
Reply

Quick Navigation:

Easily create a Forum Website with Website Toolbox.