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Chris M

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Reply with quote  #1 
Does anyone know more about the history of the 8 Kings stack?

The earliest version I've come across was in a Genii Forum post: "is how it appeared in Modern Magic (1876), though I know there are several earlier references (back to at least 1805, in William Frederick Pinchbeck's The Expositor)."

Anyone know more?
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Chi Han

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Reply with quote  #2 
Darwin Ortiz in the annotated Erdnase points to Cremer's The Magicians Own Book (around the 1850's) as being his first finding of it, appearing later in The Secret Out by the same author.
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Chris M

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Reply with quote  #3 
Awesome, cheers Chi Han Yeo! [smile]
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Chris M

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Reply with quote  #4 
It seems that 8Kings predates Si Stebbins by quite a bit! [smile]
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Steve Burton

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Reply with quote  #5 
Probably the earliest in English is William Pinchbeck's description in The Expositor from 1805. But the idea of cyclical stack is much older than this description.
Here are some books that described the Eight Kings stack.

Pinchbeck, The Expositor, 1805
Magician’s Own Book, 1857
The Secret Out, 1859
Cremer, Hanky Panky, 1872
Hoffman, Modern Magic, 1876 
Hercat, Card Tricks, 1888
Hilliar, Modern Magician’s Handbook, 1902
David Devant, Magic Made Easy, 1910
Ellis Stanyon, Stanyon’s Magic, May, 1913
George Johnson, The Magic Wand, March, 1919
Raymond Dixie, The Boy Magician, 1922
Charles Eastman, French’s Manipulative Magic, 1930
Annemann, The Book without a Name, 1931
Stewart Judah, Subtle Problems You Will Do, 1937
Hilliard, Card Magic, 1945
Also Harry Stanley, Henry Hay, Jim Steinmeyer, Ralph Hull, Wilfrid Jonson, etc.
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Robin Dawes

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Reply with quote  #6 
Si Stebbins published his stack around 1898.  In Creative Magic (Steve Humble, Martin Duffy) the authors observe that Stebbins admitted developing his system from a magician named Salem Cid, but I haven't been able to find any information about him.   Humble and Duffy go on to mention that progressive cyclic stacks, of which the Stebbins stack is the best known example, were described in print much earlier - in the early 1600's - by Gaspar Cardoso de Sequeira and by Minguet.

My source for this info:

https://books.google.ca/books?id=YW7GAQAAQBAJ&pg=PA48&lpg=PA48&dq=salem+cid+history+of+magic#v=onepage&q=salem%20cid%20history%20of%20magic&f=false

I have also heard Max Maven describe Cardoso de Sequeira as the true originator of the Si Stebbins stack.
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Mbreggar

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Reply with quote  #7 
I think Giobbi mentioned the Stebbins order came from a dude named Galloso
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EVILDAN

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Reply with quote  #8 
Does anyone use the 8 King stack? I never bothered to remember it. In hindsight it seems it would be easier to remember than some other memorized deck stacks.
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DJ

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Reply with quote  #9 
Quote:
Originally Posted by EVILDAN
Does anyone use the 8 King stack? I never bothered to remember it. In hindsight it seems it would be easier to remember than some other memorized deck stacks.


I've used the first five cards in the sequence for my JawDroppers! 2 contest submission.  It's very easy to remember and if a trick calls for a memorized setup I usually go with those.

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pnielan

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Reply with quote  #10 
Stebbins originated LONG before it was called Stebbins. 
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François Lagrange

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Reply with quote  #11 
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In "Mnemonica," Tamariz refers to a book published in Vienna in 1593. It’s called Giochi di carte bellissimi di regola, e di memoria, and has been reprinted with commentary by Vanni Bossi. It contains the "earliest known record of the mathematical arrangement commonly known as the Si Stebbins Stack."

Apparently Mister Bossi has plans for an English language version for the near future.

Published?


Unfortunately, Vanni Bossi died a decade ago, but an English translation was published in 2007 in la Gibeciere along with Vanni Bossi's essay on Galasso's work.

Here's an extract from  a review by Jamy Ian Swiss of The Aretalogy of Vanny Bossi (book about Vanni Bossi's magic published in 2016) that mentions the stack published in the antique treatise.

Remarkably, the book begins with the first printed description of a stacked deck system, presaging what in modern times would become known as the Si Stebbins system. Along with this principle is also described a multi-phase routine of effects which will be quite recognizable to memdeck enthusiasts, but which comprises the first known card routine recorded in the literature of conjuring. Gallaso includes split faces (later put to exquisite use by Hofzinser), and in the realm of cheating, descriptions of nail-nicking and punch work, marked cards, and shiners. Suffice to say it is a work of monumental historical importance, and Vanni Bossi’s name will forever be associated with its discovery and examination. (The Summer 2007 issue of Gibecière is obtainable from the Conjuring Arts Research Center.)

 

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