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RayJ

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Reply with quote  #1 
Sorry if I sound like a broken record but this piracy stuff just kills me.

So I went on "the google" to look for the Matthieu Bich's Thinner trailer after watching Magicorthodoxy's review. I was looking at the results and whaddya know, I found where I could buy the instructions for $3.99. What a deal! Of course only the secret was included, no gimmicks.

So I looked at the website's mission statement and wanted to vomit. Makes the place sound like a 501c3.

And it leads you to believe the company is based in the UK. But if you click on the Contact button it clearly gives an address in China.

Is there really nothing that can be done? I know China is rife with piracy and industrial thievery, but nothing can be done?

They even have a menu where you can click on a list of magic creators.

I'll bet none of whom ever see a penny.

Sad.
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Bulla

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Reply with quote  #2 
Yeah, I don't think there's really anything you can do about it. They operate outside of our laws and copyrights. It's also not limited to just magic. I've noticed this has become the norm with any form of information.
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RayJ

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Reply with quote  #3 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bulla
Yeah, I don't think there's really anything you can do about it. They operate outside of our laws and copyrights. It's also not limited to just magic. I've noticed this has become the norm with any form of information.


You are correct in saying that it is not limited to magic.  The theft of intellectual property is a major problem.  It is estimated to be between $225 and $600 billion dollars annually.

Obviously magic is a small part of that.  But as a community of consumers we want creators to keep creating.  They will to a point, but there was a post recently about a magician giving away his work for free just because he was so upset over the piracy.  He decided it was better to give it away than see thieves prosper.  Will he ever publish again?  Why would he, unless or until there is some security?


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Rudy Tinoco

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Reply with quote  #4 
As Bulla said, I don't think that much can be done about it. I had to lower the price of the HaLo Project because they were selling them for $2.99 on the Chinese sites. I contacted them but (as you'd expect) they never replied.

As someone whose material has been stolen and used for someone else's gain, I'm not losing any sleep over it. I fully believe that you reap what you sow.

I'll continue to do my best to be a man of integrity and honor, trusting that those who choose to live a life of taking what doesn't belong to them, will inevitably have to answer for their actions.

Rudy

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RayJ

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Reply with quote  #5 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rudy Tinoco
As Bulla said, I don't think that much can be done about it. I had to lower the price of the HaLo Project because they were selling them for $2.99 on the Chinese sites. I contacted them but (as you'd expect) they never replied.

As someone whose material has been stolen and used for someone else's gain, I'm not losing any sleep over it. I fully believe that you reap what you sow.

I'll continue to do my best to be a man of integrity and honor, trusting that those who choose to live a life of taking what doesn't belong to them, will inevitably have to answer for their actions.

Rudy


Well said and that is the right perspective.  Thanks for allowing me to vent. 
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Anthony Vinson

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Reply with quote  #6 
We as individuals can help by refusing to support piracy sites. This includes not watching unauthorized videos posted on YouTube and similar sites. We can also help by buying directly from creators, manufacturers, and authorized distributors. May not sound like much, but it makes a difference. I can't police the world, but I can police myself. 

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RayJ

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Reply with quote  #7 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony Vinson
We as individuals can help by refusing to support piracy sites. This includes not watching unauthorized videos posted on YouTube and similar sites. We can also help by buying directly from creators, manufacturers, and authorized distributors. May not sound like much, but it makes a difference. I can't police the world, but I can police myself. 

Av  


Totally agree.  We can make a difference and it starts with ourselves.

Well said AV!
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Rudy Tinoco

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Reply with quote  #8 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony Vinson
We as individuals can help by refusing to support piracy sites. This includes not watching unauthorized videos posted on YouTube and similar sites. We can also help by buying directly from creators, manufacturers, and authorized distributors. May not sound like much, but it makes a difference. I can't police the world, but I can police myself. 

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Truth.

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Dave Campbell

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Reply with quote  #9 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony Vinson
We as individuals can help by refusing to support piracy sites. This includes not watching unauthorized videos posted on YouTube and similar sites. We can also help by buying directly from creators, manufacturers, and authorized distributors. May not sound like much, but it makes a difference. I can't police the world, but I can police myself. 

Av  


Yep -- I try to do that whenever possible.


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Michaelblue

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Reply with quote  #10 
Anyone who does click on one of those is taking a real chance. Some of them exist only to mess up your software, and you will see less money in your bank account.  
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RayJ

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Reply with quote  #11 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michaelblue
Anyone who does click on one of those is taking a real chance. Some of them exist only to mess up your software, and you will see less money in your bank account.  


Perhaps that is called poetic justice.  

I'm sure some people probably don't understand what is going on, but most likely do.
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Michaelblue

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Reply with quote  #12 
[smile]
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Bizzaro

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Reply with quote  #13 

A couple thoughts:

1. It's not JUST overseas people who sell pirated items. It happens on our home turf too. Magic dealers buy knock offs because they are cheaper which waters down the quality of what is available. Gone are the days of P&L and the like (and if so, they are damned pricey for good reason). Recently, someone called out Daytona magic for carrying knockoffs, which is not new, but someone with some clout finally said something. MAK magic sadly carries cheap chinese and india knockoffs, Magic Makers, and the list goes on. The only thing we can do is not support these people, (Never buy anything from a company called "MODERN MAGIC". They are a front for knockoffs), but as long as cheap asses who don't care or don't know, there will always be a market.

2. If you are a creator who gets stolen from, DON'T POINT IT OUT! Don't tell ANYONE because then people will know and the unscrupulous will purchase them. Bad press is still press.

3. On a personal note: As someone who has things stolen, knocked off, etc I don't let it get me down. The items are usually inferior and anyone who buys them deserves what they get. The people who pirate videos and non-tangible things were likely not going to buy it anyway. However, if your material is solid and they like you as a performer/creator, they might support you down the line. I'd rather people like me and what I do than make an extra couple bucks. Besides, by the time the stuff gets ganked, I have already made the main chunk of cash I am going to anyway. If it's a good item, trickle sales will occur and I prefer money over time.

It sucks and there is no quick immediate fix. Find a way to get around it, over it, or under it. It's ok to be mad about it and let that drive you to do something about it, but it's here to stay so learn to navigate it and make it work for you. Moral of the story, evolve or get out of the way.


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RayJ

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Reply with quote  #14 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bizzaro

A couple thoughts:

1. It's not JUST overseas people who sell pirated items. It happens on our home turf too. Magic dealers buy knock offs because they are cheaper which waters down the quality of what is available. Gone are the days of P&L and the like (and if so, they are damned pricey for good reason). Recently, someone called out Daytona magic for carrying knockoffs, which is not new, but someone with some clout finally said something. MAK magic sadly carries cheap chinese and india knockoffs, Magic Makers, and the list goes on. The only thing we can do is not support these people, (Never buy anything from a company called "MODERN MAGIC". They are a front for knockoffs), but as long as cheap asses who don't care or don't know, there will always be a market.

2. If you are a creator who gets stolen from, DON'T POINT IT OUT! Don't tell ANYONE because then people will know and the unscrupulous will purchase them. Bad press is still press.

3. On a personal note: As someone who has things stolen, knocked off, etc I don't let it get me down. The items are usually inferior and anyone who buys them deserves what they get. The people who pirate videos and non-tangible things were likely not going to buy it anyway. However, if your material is solid and they like you as a performer/creator, they might support you down the line. I'd rather people like me and what I do than make an extra couple bucks. Besides, by the time the stuff gets ganked, I have already made the main chunk of cash I am going to anyway. If it's a good item, trickle sales will occur and I prefer money over time.

It sucks and there is no quick immediate fix. Find a way to get around it, over it, or under it. It's ok to be mad about it and let that drive you to do something about it, but it's here to stay so learn to navigate it and make it work for you. Moral of the story, evolve or get out of the way.



Bizzaro, great post.  Sorry you've been ripped off.  Thanks for not being reluctant to call certain companies out.  We need more of that and maybe that will have an impact.
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RayJ

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Reply with quote  #15 
So this is probably going to be the last time I post about piracy.  What I think needs to be done going forward is for the magic community to simply take a stand.  Every time you see something being ripped off or see an authorized posting of a video or an unauthorized posting of a reveal, call the company or the person out.  Explain to them what they are doing to hurt the art.  May or may not help, but it won't hurt I'll bet.  Plus, hopefully you'll feel better for it.

Doing nothing is easy.  It just doesn't seem right.
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